The election of Obama and the future of US-Muslim relations - an interesting debate between a right-wing Pakistani and a left-wing Pakistani

we_are_nuts Says:
November 6th, 2008

It is amazing that nut jobs remain nut jobs be it from the East or the West. The problem with Pakistan as i have been professing on this site since pre-Zardaro era is not USA/West/Israel/India but Pakistan itself. I had a huge long debate about Taliban/Pakistan/USA/Israel with some jerk called --- on this forum. The question i asked was what if everybody leaves Afghanistan and its back to square one (which it might be soon) then what happens? Does that take care of the sectarian problem in Para Chinar? Does that heal the rift created by the religious nut jobs from Saudia Arabia and Iran between Shia and Sunnis?

The US election is as much a slap in the face of the religious nut jobs/conspiracy theorists in Pakistan (or Pakistani jerks living outside Pakistan spewing hate even though they live in foreign lands) than the religious nut jobs in the US.

A simple question:If a man by the name of Alexander Omar Bradley was somehow able to run for the post of Prime Minister in Pakistan, how many Pakistanis would vote for him?

I stick to my premise that Pakistan has to change from within and not without.

And its amazing that the debate is steered back towards Muslims, Jews, and Christians by jerks like you. The debate is Central Asian Republics, Oil, and Money. IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH MUSLIMS…RELIGIONS ARE USED BY ALL SIDES TO INFLUENCE PEOPLE BE IT WEST OR EAST. The Catholic Pope lives in a palatial residence in the middle of Italy without paying any taxes and dresses in gold and silver while claiming to represent a relgion of a carpenter whose main job was to feed and heal the poor. The Muslim Imams live in a palaces right outside Mecca while jerks in Iran live with little boys in their hujras..

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You crazy jerks amaze the heck out of normal people. Let’s see, if we are believe the same sources that you quote about Rahm (about Israel, Mossad Blah, Blah…)then i come to the conclusion:

A ‘manchurian’ President-Elect of the Unites States of America named Barack Hussien Obama II, who is a closeted muslim and studied in Indonesian Madrassahs learning to hate Christians and Jews now pretending to be a member of the United Church of Christ, has hired a Mossad double agent as his Cheif of Staff who has more loyalty to Israel then to Barak?…

---- why don’t you write novels?

Rahm is from Chicago and so is Barack. He is hard noosed guy who has made his way up by trempling on jerks like you and maybe some nice people. You are using the Republican talking points against a Democratic White House Chief of Staff while all the while cursing the Republican President of the Unites States of America named George Bush for causing havoc around the world. I think Bush/Republicans/Bohner couldn’t find a better ally in the world than you……

I just want to point out that the American people are not stupid. There was a choice in front of them which said that we either chose the ‘tougher on world’ guy or ‘lighter on world’ guy. Either way, no world power or people will ever give their power up volunatarily, i.e., if anybody wants it, they would have to fight for it (like the Chinese, not Al-Qaeda). The American people simply realized that without the economic power, the country will not have the influence in the world that it has today. Economy trumps everything and thus the people gave their verdict.

Lately, its been actually a very simple calculus in the US for winning elections, either you scare the people with terrorists or you scare them to death with the economy. Unfortunately, the economy was out of Pappy Bush’s control this time…

Barack had a little bit harder task, you know :) , with his name being Barack Hussein Obama II, Kenyan father, Indonesian step father, a blazing seperatist black church pastor named Wright shouting ‘God Damn America’ or ‘US of KKK A’ and a 70’s erra local rebel (we shall call him a rebel not terrorist) named Bill Ayers. As i said, American people are not stupid, they knew all about this stuff as this information was peddeled from coast to coast but 63 million Americans still voted for him. Either they are really stupid, or they see something in him…

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Taimur Says:
November 6th, 2008

Think again buds, with your brain now.
You think we have created all the miseries aka terrorism. Lets go back to 911, Bush missiled pentagon, destroyed twin towers and killed his own people and then blamed on ‘terrorists’ OBLaden. If you don’t believe me, search on youtube. CIA/Government funded these same terrorist groups in the past to get things done. Also our own beloved ISI was involved in this dirty act. Now all they/and us are doing is SWEEPING them and including innocent people. If you still hail OBAMA, then think again buds!

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we_are_nuts Says:
November 7th, 2008

@Taimur
“Obama will be no better than Bush who started all this, well maybe a minute difference but nothing to get excited about”… “Think again buds, with your brain now.”

I should say i get pleasure in putting poeple like you down…

The only thing that doesn’t need to get excited is you little d**k so you don’t go out and reproduce more babies with walnut size brains like yours. However, i wouldn’t be that confident in your ability to reproduce let alone get excited!

CIA/Mossad are not capable of pulling something like 9/11 off. Got it? If it were true, it cost USA and Israel billions and billions of $$$ in actual money as well as trillions of $$$ in opportunity costs. They didn’t need 9/11 to invade Iraq, that was ginned up by other means that were avaialble to them already. The only culprit left is ISI whose abilities are in front of you as they are grappling with the fact that they might just lose a quarter of Pakistan. ISI is more show than game. Rose glasses are off and people see ISI for what it is, a f**ked up agency which has ended up eating Pakistan.

Now, has the US used 9/11 as an excuse to mess around in the world? Yes, but ofcourse. But why don’t you blame the Saudis, the Pakistanis(ISI), the Iraqi exiles, the Afghani warlords that are helping the US play this game. The game cannot be played just by the US. It takes two to tango, and as long as Al-Qaeda/Taliban/Jerks like you are hell bent on participating, the dance goes on.

So if you are a Pakistani, you are a half nut job, and if you are Muslim Pakistani, you are a complete nut job.

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Taimur Says:
November 7th, 2008

@we_are_nuts
Actually YOU ARE NUTS, here’s why.
Are you sure that U.S. wasn’t behind 911, well see if your mind can recall the so called plane crashing into Pentagon. First a plane cannot fly at that altitude, it’s virtually impossible, second how the hell weren’t there any parts of a Boeing 747, third why did FBI extract all the video evidences (there’s one on youtube that was released and it shows nose of a missile)…think buddy think…use your pea sized brain. I’ll help you, it was nothing but a missile.

Then you talk about MONEY. You know how much US is spending in wars right now??? Trillions! Money is no problem for them, even in this recent banking crisis they have enough to bail banks out so don’t talk about money. If you are talking about damages (twin towers, pentagon), it wasn’t much, I don’t know the exact figure though, you can do a research on that.

I agree with one thing that Saudi, Israel and Pakistan were all involved in this. I’m not blaming US for everything but I’m saying that they directed this.

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we_are_nuts Says:
November 7th, 2008

@Taimur
Its exactly this stubborness from people like you who refuse to believe that there are muslims out there who can pull off something like 9/11. I never had any doubt that there are religious nut jobs out there who are hell bent on killing innocent people (on both sides). Who are these people in Al-Qaeda? Granted, they were created initially via the Afghan jihad and left to the dogs afterwards. To some how insinuate that these so called muslims (Al-Qaeda) are completely innocent in this blood bath is beyound crazy, its finatic, which is exactly what organizations like Al-Qaeda are looking for. Finatics like you, who are just ignorant about the real world and how it operates, much like the Governor of Alaska.

Your understanding of economics is not even marginal at best. I was actually not talking about the buildings of twin towers or pentagon, which i think you picked up on….Anyways, who is them? Money is not a problem for US? LOL. Let’s work on ECON 101. The US runs huge trade deficits with the world. Reason, US consumes a lot more from the world than it produces (willing to produce, which goes into the concept of economies of scale, comparative advantage, Adam Smith and so forth). Lately its been running huge fiscal (budget) deficits as well because of the spending in Iraq as well as huge tax cuts. The US can print all the $$ in the world, which will however start inflating everything as well. The point, “they” tend to only pick fights they can win and which usually makes them more money and tries to keep the other side at bay. Now, seems like both Iraq and Afghanistan have gone haywire due to foot on the enemies throat stratgy, which has created a lot of collateral damage along the way as well.

Your fantasy that US some how wants to keep killing muslims for just the heck of it is obtuse and stupid. Why aren’t they killing the Chinese? The only people that are suffering and will suffer are poor, downtrodden, hopeless, and jobless muslims around the world, including in Pakistan.